With all respect. Sorry X2 Fans ***Warning***

[Lauren]

*innocently rags Drastic's head and bangs it once* Sowwy, you were making me mad!

think about it! Kurt was locked up for who knows how long in a cell! He just lost his fitness for a bit! he was still sexay dern it! and just because he didn't have a six pack, it don't mean he's not sexay!

[The Drastic Spastic]

Originally posted by Lauren
*innocently rags Drastic's head and bangs it once* Sowwy, you were making me mad!

think about it! Kurt was locked up for who knows how long in a cell! He just lost his fitness for a bit! he was still sexay dern it! and just because he didn't have a six pack, it don't mean he's not sexay!

*pokes Lauren in the eye*

Pssst. A WEEK. Maybe. Probably less. It's not like the "brain-washing" took a lot of time (five seconds!!!) so I can't imagine why they'd be keeping him longer. And a week is not time enough to lose any noticeable muscle from a lifetime of intensive exercise.

People who find him sexy scare me. You don't have to be toned to be sexy, but you do have to not be Alan Cumming. He's.. so sickly looking. And, you know, kinda weasel-y. And he gives the impression of large amounts of grease. :ick

[Lauren]

*screams and clutches eye* Meanie! *makes swiping cat like gestures with hand not occupied in holding in eye juice*

Don't make fun of my man! he may look sickly, but I still think he looks fine

and maybe it only took a week, but being tortured could have messed him up!

[kurtlover]

OK! this is turning into a fight...and i'm getting angry because it seems like you all ignore my first post here...where i asked for diplomacy and politeness.

so i'm gonna ask it for a second time, no more bashing ok?
don't make me close this thread.

[Lauren]

awww the fight scenes were only playing...*makes cute face to try and win you over* it won't happen again I pwomise

[The Drastic Spastic]

Sometimes I get carried away....

Originally posted by Lauren
*screams and clutches eye* Meanie! *makes swiping cat like gestures with hand not occupied in holding in eye juice*

Don't make fun of my man! he may look sickly, but I still think he looks fine

and maybe it only took a week, but being tortured could have messed him up!

My squeedily spooch!

You just want to take care of poor widdle baby Alan. I'm on to ya....

Messed him up mentally, but unless they were cutting away large slabs of muscle as torture, it wouldn't screw him over too much physically. But... maybe they force fed him! Would explain the tummy...

[Nandireya]

Can't say I was all that impressed with their interpretation of Kurt myself...or who they picked to play him...I've got nothing against Alan, but he is NOT the swoonworthy Nighty we deserved! But I liked the movie...

[Northstars Love]

But remember Nan, the X-movies do not necessarily reflect the X comics. This has been said. The main characters and their main powers are in place, but there are some differences. No Ms. Marvel powers for Rogue. And Nighty with tattoos.

But as for Alan. I liked him as Nighty. His portrayal as the blue elf was the reason I got back into the X books.

[kurtlover]

Yay Nandi! you're so right!
see people? she expressed our feelings on a polite nice way and Ken who has a different opinion, did the same!
hehe i'm not angry anymore, but remember what could happen if i got angry again....
*coughcoughkaaaff!*closing the thread*coughkaafffcough*

[Bitsy]

kurtlover's right! Let's not continue this childish bickering. Drastic, if you thought that Kurt wasn't portrayed to your liking, that's all right. Just as long as you respect the people who thought he was fine!

Now, let's all join hands and sing!

All we are saaaaaaaaaaaaying, is give peace a chaaaaance!

[The Drastic Spastic]

I still can't get how someone who appears to be so completely sick, mentally and physically, can be sexually attractive to so many people. He's just... unhealthy. He cuts himself, he cowers in a corner, he "hits on" Storm in an offensive preachy way, and people want to have his babies? Why? Why? Why? No really. (And I'm talking about X2 Nightcrawler here, not Alan, just so we're absolutely clear. )

[Bitsy]

Ok....since Drastic is ignoring all our peaceful let's-stop-arguing-about-why-we-like-X2-Nightcrawler posts, we just have one thing to say.

INNER BEAUTY!!!

Ok? Just because someone doesn't look or act like, say, Orlando Bloom, Brad Pitt, or one of those other Hollywood hotties, doesn't mean someone can't find them or their character attractive. You pointed out the negative points of Nighty, but there are positive ones as well.

He's sweet, sensitive, thinks of others, doesn't put himself before anyone else (aka. The Rogue rescue scene), has a pure soul, and a strong dedication to God! I find nothing wrong with that detail. As long as he's not acting like a Puritan.

And on top of all that: He has got the SWEETEST accent on the planet! When he said "Please don't kill me! I never meant to harm anyone!" I wanted to hug him SO BADLY!!!

That's how we feel. You can mumble and complain all you like, JUST DON'T POST IT! PLEASE!!!

*hides behind Lauren.* She looks vicious, I'm sorry....

[kurtlover]

OK seems like everybody is IGNORING ME AGAIN.

i don't wanna adress to people here one by one because its rude and against the rules for the staff but you know who you are.....
i'm this close to lock the thread, this is the third time i'm mentioning it, it wont be four time.

Look: Everybody has different tastes here, if Jane likes white maybe Jen dislike it, Jen would say she hates white, but that's up to HER in expressing the way she was going to talk about it without offending anybody....but JANE has also to understand its nothing personal against her and not being that sensitive....


oh god, look what you just made me to do, i'm now telling explanations in a five years old's language, do you seriously want it to be in this way?

And i'm putting my foot down to this, one more time and the thread will be locked.

[Bitsy]

*hangs her head in shame*

Sorry, kurtlover. I know I shouldn't be responding to these threads, but I am trying to let bygones be bygones. Here's my two cents about this: I don't have a problem with Drastic not liking X2 Kurt. And I hope that she respects our reasons why we do like X2 Kurt. Don't ask for an explanation ANYBODY, we just do.

There. End of conversation. Who wants pie?

[The Drastic Spastic]

Originally posted by Bitsy
*hangs her head in shame*

Sorry, kurtlover. I know I shouldn't be responding to these threads, but I am trying to let bygones be bygones. Here's my two cents about this: I don't have a problem with Drastic not liking X2 Kurt. And I hope that she respects our reasons why we do like X2 Kurt. Don't ask for an explanation ANYBODY, we just do.

There. End of conversation. Who wants pie?

Mostly, I'm just a sore loser. I don't like it? Tough shit. That's the way he is, and always will be, now. *depressed* I just need to vent...

And his accent might have been cute to you, but that still doesn't make it a good German accent.

[Ult_Sm86]

Well you guys can all say what you want but ALan must've done something right if my friend who is a HARDCORE Logan fan said "kurt was pretty damn cool".
I mean He didn't have the exact tone. So what? only fans will notice that and Brian was trying to please both fans and non-fans. At least he's in the movie and blue and a tail right? And german? That's good enough for an intor into a sequel, he's gonna be in the next so expect more. Not to mention I think that he'll be more expert looking and he said himself (Alan that is) that they shot the body scene so suddenly and it was 10 hours to get make up on and such. The shape he was in compared to movies like spy kids. He fighting trainers and stuff, i mean he was fit. Plus the only real acrobatics he did was flipping around in the white house the rest was go get her *bamf* go over there *bamf* takeing orders form everyone (which is something he'd do anyways being polite kurt and all) He was meant to be in top acrobat form. He did more kick boxing than flipping.

[Nandireya]

Originally posted by The Drastic Spastic
And his accent might have been cute to you, but that still doesn't make it a good German accent.

Too true...and Alan admitted that himself

[taekwondodo]

I've got to admit, I actually didn't see anything wrong with the debate on this thread other than the brief foray into virtual violence between Lauren and Drastic. That wasn't cool or cute at all. Otherwise though, what's wrong with a little vehement disagreement? Some people think Alan Cumming is cute, sexy and a great NC, some of us found him anything but sexy and more than a little disappointing. I really don't see anything wrong with debating the disagreement so long as it doesn't devolve into any more virtual violence, personal attacks or actual insults to the actor. And for the record, it's not an insult to say he didn't look terribly fit, acrobatic or sexy. THose are valid opinions that others can validly disagree with. THe things that would be insulting I won't even put in here. But can't we disagree on something and just debate it civilly? It is a given that Alan Cumming is movie-Kurt. THose of us who aren't thrilled with that are stuck with it none the less as I hold out no hope whatsoever that he will be replaced. Doesn't mean we don't wish it were otherwise though. It won't stop me from going to see X3 when it comes out and hoping NC has a big role either - but I will hope that the actor makes an effort to get in much better shape for the next movie - if he doesnt that leather uniform is *not* going to be very flattering. Anyway. Debate good. Flinging insults bad. Can we debate? Or drop it since we've all said pretty much what we want to anyway and no minds are going to be changed by any opinions expressed here?

[Nandireya]

I thought Alan was very good at that interpretation of Kurt...even though it wasn't the Kurt I wanted to see...and I doubt he could pull off THAT Kurt...

[The Drastic Spastic]

Originally posted by Bamfman86
At least he's in the movie and blue and a tail right? And german? That's good enough for an intor into a sequel, he's gonna be in the next so expect more.

Well... I'm really hoping he won't have much of a part at all in the next one. Really really hoping. Cutting heads off chickens and spraying the blood around while chanting hoping. Cause, I would have LOVED X2 if there had been no "Nightcrawler". The blue, tail, and "German" accent was all that connected him to the Nightcrawler that inspired me to buy all those comics. He was like a Nightcrawler that had been brought back from the dead wrong, you know? Horrors.

[White Lady]

This discussion kind of dovetails into a question I've been thinking of posting regarding why, exactly, everyone is attracted to the Nightcrawler character. Sorry if is a bit off-topic, but ...

... it seems to me that one answer to Drastic's question of how anyone could be attracted to Moviecrawler may also be an answer to my more general question above: the character as played by Alan Cumming is a framework on which viewers hang their own projections (and I mean this in a good, creative way). So what is it about the framework that is or isn't attractive to us? Not the actor who plays the character, but the characteristics of the framework that either appeal or don't? How is Moviecrawler's framework different from Comiccrawler? What is it about embroidering on this framework that brings us here?

(Does this make sense?)

Also, I very much agree that Moviecrawler's scarification and other divergences from Comiccrawler had more to do with practicalities (i.e., the limitations of make-up) than anything else. I also think, though, that with 30+ years of canon building up a framework for Comiccrawler, and 30+ years of readers' embroidery on that framework, it would have been virtually impossible to find ANY actor who would satisfy even a majority of fans, let alone everyone. This might be another reason why Moviecrawler diverges from canon: it's easier to create a "new" character than accurately recreate the old one.

(Plus, it doubles the fanfic possibilities, thanks be to the Goddess.)

[The Drastic Spastic]

Originally posted by White Lady
So what is it about the framework that is or isn't attractive to us?

How is Moviecrawler's framework different from Comiccrawler?

What is it about embroidering on this framework that brings us here?

I also think, though, that with 30+ years of canon building up a framework for Comiccrawler, and 30+ years of readers' embroidery on that framework, it would have been virtually impossible to find ANY actor who would satisfy even a majority of fans, let alone everyone.

Absolutely everything about it isn't attractive, to me, anyway.

By framework I guess you mean back story and personality. Comiccrawler started out being based on fun, caring about people, and a love of being unique. Then we have Moviecrawler, who is completely based on faith, and being blue. A nice ugly mutant for the movie.

Here? To the board? I always liked the original framework... and now I mostly just like the board.

I know very few "fans" who were actually satisfied with Alan. They might think he was okay, but most if not all of the people wetting themselves over him were only brought into the fandom by the movie.

[Bitsy]

SIIIIIIGH!!!

You know what? This is getting annoying. I know nobody's holding a gun to my head to make me read these threads, but this is truly becoming irksome.

Drastic, we have said this hundreds of times: WE RESPECT YOUR VIEWS ON MOVIECRAWLER! Will you please stop making rude comments like that? There are tons of things I can say about comiccrawler (and believe me, there are!), but I'm keeping them to myself because I know that it'll upset people! Just because you don't agree with someone about something, doesn't mean you have to keep mentioning it over and over and over again! It's not like we're trying to convert you into like Alan or how he portrayed Kurt. Just say "I didn't like Alan or moviecrawler" and leave it at that! When you keep pointing out what you didn't like, it makes the people who do like him feel silly.

I know that's not your intention, but I'm speaking from personal experience here. I use to go on about how I didn't like a particular celebrity (for example) and my friends who did like this celebrity got really pissed at me when I kept saying what I didn't like. They said I was being rude and inconsiderate. They respected how I felt, but told me to keep my views to myself and now that I think about it, I was being rude. This board is suppose to be where we can come and discuss why we LIKE Nightcrawler, movie or comic version!

And if what I just said still hasn't changed anything, then I'm all for kurtlover closing this thread! I came here to discuss why I like Alan and Moviecrawler and I personally do not what this thread ruining that for me.

(Sorry if I sound bitchy. I just had a bit of a rough day at work.)

[taekwondodo]

Yep, the level of civility on this thread is negligible to be honest. But in defense of the thread itself, it actually was started for the express purpose of Dras stating that s/he didn't like the movie and why and apparently looking for opinions for and against. It was also, I might add, partially inspired by a movie fan going into the Evo-forum and starting a thread there for the sole purpose of bashing the show. Doesn't justify the general level of rudeness that's been displayed here though. I've got to say though, that movie fans seem to be a tad more easily miffed than Evo fans.

If things don't tone down then the thread probably should be closed.

(But I still don't see anything wrong with not liking movie-Kurt and saying so, it should just be done more politely. And for those who don't want to read opinions on why Alan Cumming wasn't a good choice, then avoiding this thread in the first place would be a good plan.)

[Wolvertique]

I don't see why people find Will Riker, on the Star Trek: Next Generation Enterprise, attractive. I think he's boring, unexciting, and at best average at his job. Yet I've found many women who swoon over him.

I don't deny that other people can find those I find utterly unattractive to be attractive. I don't understand why and probably never will, but if they want to go for someone who I think is utter ick, let them. People are all different. So what if some people think Cumming did a good job as Nightcrawler when you think he's lower than toad spit? You're not going to change their minds by arguing with them anyhow. I can't change the minds of the people who like Riker, either.