The New 52: Batman and Robin

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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Bamfette » Sun Sep 18, 2011 2:10 am

Dammit. Why are all the bat books good? I wanted ONE Batman book, dammit. ONE! I'm up to three.

I wasn't expecting much from this, but I really liked it. It's very new reader friendly, in that it gives you a rundown of Bruce's history, which is deftly accomplished in an organic way that also lets you in on the personalities of him and Damian. Even if you already know everything (which, lets face it, most people do) the banter keeps it fresh. then they fight some bad guys, and you see how reckless Damian can be, which leads to the death of said bad guys, and Bruce's frustration is palatable. All in all, good stuff, i thought. Damian is a complete prick, but in an interesting sort of way, and i should be interesting to see how he and Bruce play off eachother in the future.

the one thing that bugs me is why would a public swimming pool be housed over a nuclear laboratory.

[Edited on 18/9/11 by Bamfette]
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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Sun Sep 18, 2011 4:25 am

It's the only DCnU I've read so far and I wasn't completely impressed.

I wasn't scared off either though.
To quote myself from my Comic Book Blow-Out thread:

It's like nothing to rebooted. I don't get what's going on. And also, as predicted, way too much dark-negative, debbie-downer type-casted dialogue coming from both of them.

I genuinely feel like this is nothing fresh or new, so why did they make the change if it's nothing new? The only difference is that it's Bruce and Damian not Dick & Damian, and to me, that makes the book worse.

Already it seems like a very negative title. The great thing about Batman & Robin is one personality always has off-set the other. Dark & brooding Bruce as Batman and his young, chipper, sidekick who is always ready to kick butt.
Be it Dick (ambitious and gifted), Jason (talented and overzealous), Stephanie (eager and dedicated), or Tim (compassionate and loyal), the Robin personality has always been a way to keep the miserable-outlook that is Bruce's, in check.

On the flip-side of that, when Dick was Batman, he was a slightly more upbeat version of the character. Even Gordon noticed the differences, might've even called him out on it if I remember correctly. Meanwhile, Damian was the "kick in the face first, ask questions later" type character who didn't want to follow a rule book, and certainly didn't want to impress anyone with high-flying gymnastics work. He was there to do business, and Damian Wayne is very much in the business of kicking bad-guy ass.
I have come to love this character, and I'm afraid this new take on the title will make me come to hate him.

Now, they're both a diatribe of misery. Why am i going to continue reading this book if every issue is the two of them arguing about whether Damian is not compassionate enough, or respectful enough? Or if Damian is always in Bruce's ear telling him he's too hung up on the past, how should that make the book more "interesting" or "exciting". It won't.
We already know that stuff. That's why Dick on board as Batman was so interesting. Why Dick chose the cowl, and allowed Damian on as Robin, was far more intriguing than Bruce's rationalized logic to allow his own son to do so.

Basically -- I'm giving this book 3 issues to impress me, and I'm hoping the next one does a better job. The artwork was nice, the story is cool, but I feel like nothing has changed, at least not for the better.

I want my Batman & Robin, as it was last month, back.



[Edited on 18/9/11 by Ult_Sm86]
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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Crawler » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:24 am

Damn. Now I'm going to be reading THREE Batman books.

The writing was GREAT. Nothing is flat out told, but everything is made clear through the events and dialogue.

Immediately you get a sense of who the characters are and how they relate to each other. Yes, you get yet another recounting of the origin of Batman, but it's used to great effect, illustrating (in just a few pages!) exactly what this new version of Batman's personality is, who Damian is, and how they relate. You don't just get the information that Damian is Bruce's son, but, even without knowing beforehand, you can tell what their relationship is. I thought it was pretty amazing how deftly it was shown that they have a sort of father-and-son relationship, albeit a little begrudgingly, and that Bruce didn't raise Damian and doesn't approve of how he was raised. You get the reason that Bruce made Damian Robin and his "mission statement" for the endeavor. You get just enough of Batman's history and the history of the Robin role to catch you up but not confuse you.

The dialogue and character voices were pretty darned good, especially with Bruce and Damian and Nobody. Damian doesn't sound ten, but his voice is so well-developed and clear that you immediately know that it's purposeful. You know that it's not badly done, he's just an odd kid. The battle dialogue and the "redshirt" dialogue is a little lacking, but the rest is good enough to overlook it.

The big threat has no contact with the title characters, yet is established extremely well, too. I mean, wow. That guy is scary and he's subtly connected to the main characters, so while you don't know exactly what his motivation is, you want to know.

Within a single issue, the writer made me actually care about these characters and want to read more. I call that a win.
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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby The Drastic Spastic » Sat Sep 24, 2011 2:46 am

This was really well done, in a totally creepy skin-crawling way. There's a major sense of foreboding hanging over everything in this book. Damian comes off as a little psychopath, and Bruce is trying to teach him his own code of ethics. They have a really interesting dynamic.

Is Damian a completely new character? It sounds like he's not.

They didn't find any bodies, which means we haven't seen the last of those "dead" guys. They are gonna be so icky-looking, brrr.
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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:50 pm

I gotta say, isue 2 was a MAJOR improvement.

I like that they didn't focus too heavily on the fact that Bruce is an orphan raising a son he hardly knows but rather he's a dark, moody, unrelatable super hero raising a trained-killer/sociopath whose first nature is to kill Bruce before hug him.

Alfred was great in this issue, giving Bruce advice on how to raise his son (being he did the raising of Bruce in the first place). If anyone knows how to help a young boy who is going through a traumatic time, it's Alfred.

Also, gotta say that without those first 2 pages confirming everything that happened previous to DCnU/Flashpoint still happened, I probably would've dropped the book. Now that I'm sure it's all still canon I feel much better.

But I still don't get why they changed anything at all then. If nothing in terms of backstory changed, why did they change main characters? Why bring it back to #1? Why make such a big fuss?

Oh... right...

$$$$$
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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 6:11 pm

I am really enjoying Batman and Robin.

I have to admit, at first I thought it would be way too over-the-top angsty, but they seem to be doing a decent job balancing the anger that Bruce and Damian both have with some lightheartedness and some interest.

It was good to see Bruce finally moving on a bit from his parents' deaths. That was a nice touch in issue one.

I also like the slight implication that Dick and Damian got along a lot better than Bruce and Damian - I don't know if they're going to explore that but it would be neat!

And just.... GO ALFRED! ^.^
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The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Fri Nov 18, 2011 1:02 am

So the Bruce/Damian relationship is going exactly as I predicted...


But I like it.


I don't know how to explain it, but they're focusing on Damian's inability to be corrupted by anyone, let alone his father. It seems even Bruce can't change Damian's ways. He's a young boy who has been brainwashed with hate and then quickly refilled with love and appreciation. It's ... a wonderful read. Honestly.

Slow going at first, for sure. Batman is having a hard time trusting his new Robin (understandable, he's already shown a lot of glee from beating up bad guys) but his new Robin has almost nothing but faith in his father, Batman.

His father, Bruce Wayne however is just another putz who is trying to take care of him and guide him down a good path. If I didn't know any better, it seems Damian likes his father Batman better than his father Bruce. He's pretty awesome though, as a character. It's become an exiting title, to say the least.

Still... not anywhere near as good as Marvel is right now...
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:32 am

This is officially my favorite book of the New 52.

The storytelling is wonderful, if a little too decompressed for my tastes, and the artwork works so well. The artist does an excellent job of using physical space to translate to metaphorical and emotional distance. I'm very impressed with the whole thing.

And Damian is so perfect. SO perfect. I can't get enough of him.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:03 am

Have you finished the arc yet?

Man, Damian pulled a serious fast one. I was very impressed how well he handled the whole situation. Granted I predicted the twist a mile away, but it proves how deeply distressed/blinded Bruce is that he couldn't even predict that. He's got to learn to take off the leash at some point, let Damian be his own Robin.

Here's hoping the rumors of a Robin Monthly (starting in October) are true. The story is it'll at least be a mini where he meets up with the 3 Robins (Steph, Tim, & Dick), interacts in some way with each, and then somehow, ends up going toe-to-toe with Jason Todd, and finds out just what his opinion was on Bruce this whole time.

Interesting turn of events, let's hope it happens.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:59 am

As predicted, the Robins are all finally meeting:

Even Jason Todd. But the question is... who is the person responsible for calling the meeting? And why on the cover is Damian STILL going after Tim!?
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:57 am

Damian's going after Tim because Tim and Jason kissed and made up, and the Batfamily isn't screwed up enough as it is; we need some good, old-fashioned, nose-breaking, bone-crushing, life-threatening sibling rivalry!

Anybody read issue #8 yet? It's so perfect. This is the kind of comic I really want and enjoy; pure character and relationship-building! (I should probably leave mainstream superhero comics then, huh?)
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:11 am

I absolutely loved it. I am firmly of the mind a good writer (Winnick/Aaron) can develop characters and have a great superhero comic. That said -- When did this happen? Red Hood & The Outlaws?

DEETS PLZ!!
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:07 am

Okay, SPOILERS!

Red Hood and the Outlaws issue #8, we get a flashback to something that happened a few weeks before the beginning of the Teen Titans comics and RHATO. Apparently, Tim asked Jason to track down Cassie Sandsmark's name, and Jason asked Tim to figure out what time a particular shipment was docking. The flashback showed them exchanging the information. Jason mentioned that he "hadn't been very nice" to Tim, and Tim basically said, "You were murdered, no one avenged you, you came back. You were upset. It's okay."

And then they ate pancakes.


I find it very unfair that Jason and Tim got bonding time before Dick and Tim did. Considering Dick and Tim were best brother buds forever.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:27 pm

<3 it. Can't wait for it.

I'm wondering how this whole "Court of the Owl" thing is going to effect Damian, or if it will at all. I hope not, it seems like a poor grab for imcreased readership of Bat-titles. (Like they need it?)
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:14 am

I'm hoping "Court of the Owls" will be used to lend cohesiveness to the Bat-titles; that is, give the characters more interaction with each other, build relationships, that sort of thing. I'm pretty sure the only thing it's going to do for Damian is prove his particular talents, possibly helping him grow in competency. (And maybe even compassion!)
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Mon Apr 30, 2012 7:35 pm

All I know is the cohesive build-up between Bat Titles may be needed, but I am sincerely feeling that bringing that arc into Catwoman is going to seriously drag it down.

I'm still on the fence about how a super secret organization could have been with Gotham since the years of Abraham Wayne basically (Or the Arkham guy maybe, who cares?) and no one noticed them assassinating people. With League of Assassin type skills. Are their different Talons? Or just one? And what the hell is their objective?
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Tue May 01, 2012 2:20 am

I have no idea about the secret society or their objective, but there are a variety of Talons. What happened is each one has been sort of "summoned" from the dead, each from a different time period in Gotham's history. For example, the Talon in Nightwing is from about three generations ago -- Alan Wayne's time period.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Tue May 01, 2012 2:33 am

Who? Alan Wayne? Is that the ... 'Noir guy?
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Mon May 07, 2012 4:18 am

I'm 90% certain Alan Wayne is Bruce's great-grandfather, which puts the era in the late 1800s.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Tue May 08, 2012 5:43 am

Seems like Damian is going to fight his own battles with this incident...

Also, look who's involved in Batman, Inc #1 written by Grant Morrison? Looks like the first story arc is all about this. It's an awesome idea for a plot really.

This is the story of a man and a woman fighting over the heart and soul of their child. Unfortunately for the world, the man is BATMAN, the woman is TALIA AL GHUL, and the child is DAMIAN.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Tue May 08, 2012 8:19 pm

Can I say that I'm really excited for May???
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Wed May 09, 2012 1:13 am

Right?! Damian's getting some serious development!

Also check out July!
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Dedicatedfollower467 » Wed May 09, 2012 1:40 am

I love the phrasing "brilliant show of arrogance."

Ya got that right, buddy.
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Fri May 11, 2012 6:38 pm

Okay, I'm going to read the Court of Owls Batman issue with Red Robin because I want to know if Damian's the only one who killed his Talon target.

Though I suppose it's safe to assume he wasn't. I mean... how else can you stop 'em?
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Re: The New 52: Batman and Robin

Postby Ult_Sm86 » Tue May 15, 2012 11:12 am

I'm also intrigued by the August issues of Batman, Inc. and Batman & Robin. I also like that they've made it to issue #12 and now beyond it seems, without changing up the creative team. It's still Tomasi, Gleason, & Grey. Love it.
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