Ult_Sm86 wrote:I will ne be convinced otherwise. There is no counter-argument that works to me. Bringing Wagner back completely overwrites any meaning (what little there may be in your opinion) to his death. It goes against the purpose of killing off any character.
That said -- Darkholme is here to stay, let's hope. For a while, at the least.
Ult_Sm86 wrote:I say give his death some time to really be relevant. When his absence is a constant sting, evident in the writing and the characters' reactions, his absence should bring about his return.
Ult_Sm86 wrote:What do people think of that cover, seriously? #33 is a really creepy cover! Notice the tattoo has the same color as the blood spatter on his face (and body). What clever artwork, it almost looks like the tattoo is blood on Wagner's face rather than Darkholme's natural body art. Could we be dead on here? Is this a fractured, mirrored version of Kurt Wagner that we've been dreading?
Angelique wrote:Regarding Wagner's death, I feel that every opportunity Marvel had to make it really powerful and relevant was already blown. It could have resulted in the disbanding of X-Force, if Wolverine was actually thinking instead of just stabbing stuff. It could have been the cause of Schism. (Heck, Kurt could have led Schism if he had survived.).....
Angelique wrote:I'm not saying Darkholme should be killed off, but why on earth does anyone think Marvel needs another character geared toward young male readers? Why does Marvel think they need to stuff another vengeance driven sociopath into books already filled with a monotonous glut of anti-heroes? I don't want readers to associate Nightcrawler with being boring and preachy, but I also could do without readers seeing him as just another stabbity rage machine. The danger with the direction Darkholme has taken is that he is a one-note character, and the only thing that would make him interesting to me is if they have him thinking about something other than vengeance.
Sundown wrote:Darkholme was brought in under the design concept imagery of the original Nightcrawler, but in an edgier version, to fit with the current Marvel trend. If I'm not completely mistaken, the concept of Darkholme was based on 616 Kurt in the latter part of the Excalibur run -- the sabre and loincloth era, which he had lines like "I want you to go in there and make a mess" -- kind of a tough-guy thing. Darkholme even had a similar costume in the AoA revisit. Incidentally, TJ's father seems based on a similar model, though obviously much older.
Wahnsinn wrote:Sundown wrote:Darkholme was brought in under the design concept imagery of the original Nightcrawler, but in an edgier version, to fit with the current Marvel trend. If I'm not completely mistaken, the concept of Darkholme was based on 616 Kurt in the latter part of the Excalibur run -- the sabre and loincloth era, which he had lines like "I want you to go in there and make a mess" -- kind of a tough-guy thing. Darkholme even had a similar costume in the AoA revisit. Incidentally, TJ's father seems based on a similar model, though obviously much older.
You've got it backwards. The loincloth costume was after AoA. I started getting into comics with AoA and experienced the loincloth period as it happened, rather than getting it in back-issues. I checked the numbers: #87 was the first after AoA, and #98 was the loincloth.
Wahnsinn wrote:After the trainwreck of "The Draco," nobody really did anything with him.
Wahnsinn wrote:Honestly, I think Marvel and DC are scrambling for sales. They're desperately trying to be relevant, which wouldn't be so bad if it didn't come across as just one more gimmick. Much like Kurt was written into a corner, they've backed themselves into one that will be their demise if they don't get out of it fast. I think they've forgotten how to attract and keep an audience.
Wahnsinn wrote:Bringing it back to Darkholme, I think they could do something interesting with him. They're making it look like he might not make it out of this arc, but that could be to not give away the end of the story.
Wahnsinn wrote:On a random note, am I the only one confused by Daken being in this at all? He was rather dead at the end of his solo title. Even if he faked blowing himself up, he was told in no uncertain terms that he had destroyed his healing factor and was dying. It'd be nice if they'd address that.
Sundown wrote:Ah, cool, I knew they were related but was trying to put the chicken before the egg. I was reading at the time, but the years can muddle together. That's a lot of blue mileage. Come to think of it, 616 Kurt's loincloth and swords might have had to do with the popularity of the AoA arc. Maybe they thought the gritty character got a good reception.
It makes me wonder, considering that arc basically ended Austen's career, if other writers were afraid to touch him.
Absolutely. The comic genre has always been unique from other forms of entertainment. It's like Marvel and DC are trying to turn it into something it's not, to attract new readers. Yet if they lure in reader by films or games, they don't stay, because characters are no longer written in a compelling and consistent manner. They can get a gimmick fix in other mediums with less investment. In short, alienating old readers to obtain new readers isn't the best idea, it needs to be a compromise. The same things that originally got those old readers to invest so much time and interest in the genre would work to turn new readers into long term ones.
I think all this has been planned for years.
With Fentomex added now to the new UXF line-up post Remender -- she's either a female Fanto or EVA in Fanto's costume, by the looks -- that's all team members accounted for, including Evan, but still no sign of Darkholme. Bishop is the other hinted at future member of UXF.
Wahnsinn wrote:Is Bishop supposed to be a member? I know he's supposed to be involved with the title somehow, but I haven't been reading all the interviews and stuff.
Wahnsinn wrote: After the trainwreck of "The Draco," nobody really did anything with him. He occasionally came out of the wallpaper to remind us of how religious and mopey he was or, later, to get stabbed in the chest and pout about being useless.
Ult_Sm86 wrote:Maybe Kurt Darkholme isn't revealed yet. Could we finally have our Kuroro relationship we've constantly fantasized about? (:shifty ... Well, not constantly. )
Bamfing_Bob wrote:Still, this may be a good title. But no Kurt and no Wade leaves Bob a dull boy. Gonna stick with my current stash: Uncanny Avengers, Happy (image comics), X-Treme X-Men, and Before Watchmen. Without those two characters to keep my attention, I don't feel it is worth the time or trouble...
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